An extraordinary conversation with heaven

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Before diving into this channelled conversation with heaven, here’s some background information:

If you’ve read my books you’ll know that my writing is spiritual but not religious and that although my preference is direct contact with heaven I keep an open mind about mediumship and from time to time endorse those I feel who have the credentials, endorsements and who truly work from the heart. John and Martha McGinnis got in touch with me and I was impressed by their integrity. Together they have published ten volumes of channelled psychic readings on, and critical reviews have been positive.  Martha McGinnis discovered her talent as a psychic medium seven years ago.  Her husband, who transcribed the readings, is a lawyer, and she is a businesswoman, both residing in Chicago.

The McGinnis readings explore heaven through interviews with persons residing there. The news they share is positive and consoling:  all are admitted to heaven regardless of belief;  and God is an all-loving, all-nurturing, and all-forgiving parent.  Activities in heaven are not a matter of strumming harps amidst the clouds.  Souls in heaven guide family members on earth, heal wherever there is need, study in beautiful temples, contemplate God, and express joy that traverses the cosmos.

The McGinnis readings teach that all of our loved ones survive death and we ourselves have nothing to fear from this glorious form of rebirth which is perfectly in line with the message of all my heaven titles.  Their published books also give information on how others may acquire the same psychic skills. To test the range of psychic readings through the veil between heaven and earth, John and Martha have spoken with saints, prophets, world leaders, and ordinary people. Each has a unique and fascinating story to tell, conveying a different facet of divine wisdom and its a real blessing that John and Martha have given me permission to share some of their extraordinary readings with you here.  I would like to start sharing these readings with this channelled conversation from John and Martha with none other than Jesus whose words are in bold print.

Spoiler: Some of what you are about to read below may appear controversial and no offence is intended.

Talking to Jesus

Few men in the western world have had more influence than Jesus and we (John and Martha) looked forward to this conversation more than we could say. Jesus came through loud and clear. He was a straight talker, no longer given to oracular parables, but he was still a teacher in all respects. He was very deep, very smart, and feistier than ever. He didn’t suffer Pharisees gladly.

We started this way: Dear Jesus, known in your day as Yeshua, it is a joy to speak with you. Please tell us what issues you work with, and what message you preach, in heaven today.

“We are working now on the concept of love, the real concept of love, not physical love, but love devoted to giving, the only thing which feeds your soul. That is love in the sense of complete connectedness, mutual benefit, compassion, forgiveness, and the metaphysical understanding of right. It is a love that changes from getting to giving, that forgets about taking, that longs to give, that feels the joy of connecting and the joy of bringing forth all good for your self and others. This is the only concept that needs to be learned. There is nothing greater on earth: it is a message for your community, nation and world’

“I teach devotion to the one God who gives this power of love, a great idea that will renew you and your world. God is the powerful stream of love that nourishes and cherishes all people. I urge people to try this concept and to return to their true relationship with God. When you adopt this concept you retake your place in eternity. God longs for you to recognize and assert this love and share it, and to return to a relationship with God that is unending. I stand by this river of life, and I long to bring each man into it.”

“I join hands with you in your effort. I pray you will be effective in showing man’s true nature-love, not the desire to be loved, but to give it. Don’t be sparing in teaching God’s love; man must become the active principle of that love. Jump in and take your place.”

We understand that everyone evolves in heaven. Has your view of God changed in heaven?

“My dear friend, you don’t understand. You don’t ever leave heaven, and you don’t return to heaven. You are always one with heavenly consciousness. You evolve more as you learn more, but you are always an expression of God. You are made up of the love of God. You are always in heaven and you must feel that your relationship with God is your heaven. I can’t step in and out. I never left. I was and am eternal. Remember, the Father and I are one. Now­ here-right where you are-that is heaven.”

On earth, you preached about God, his Throne, and his Kingdom. Tell us more about how you understand God today.

“God is my life, my all. God is all there is; God is the beginning and end. God is a never-ending mystery, and I am always searching for God’s endless delight. Our Father-Mother God is my ONLY relationship and is all of our life, knowing, and being. There is no end to learning about God, no end to expressing God. There is always something to be learned, always a new revelation. With knowledge of God comes a great sense of intimacy and acceptance. God is our home, beginning, end, and our all. In fact there is nothing but God, who is the answer to all questions and is all sustaining.”

Dear Rabbi, your friend John pointed out that there are many misconceptions about you in the world today. How has the world misunderstood your teaching?

“In the world today there is such fear of the spiritual life, the suffering, the sacrifice. Look at the painted faces of the suffering saints, which scare adults and especially the poor children. In fact, the spiritual life achieves the truest love and satisfaction. People were drawn to me by that love. I bathed in this love every day. The spiritual life is the greatest life: this is what people want; all their ambition lies here. Those pictures of me with a sad face, and holes in my hands and feet, are terrifying to everyone. In fact, I had the greatest life of all-the greatest joy in pouring out the love of God. There is no sacrifice in spiritual life: there is no suffering. This is the life you want, this is the great good to achieve in life. I treasured my life. And the joy I received from the Father-Mother God is what drew men to me.”

As you look at the Christian church today and how it has grown, what are your impressions? Did you have the impact you intended?

“Well, the world has moved forward. I do still love my church and all the churches on the globe. I honor every man’s effort to come closer to God. At all churches there is a soul connection; the dogmas don’t matter. God’s good cannot be confounded by misconceptions. I support this dear church. And I pray it throws off misconceptions. Man is looking today for a new kind of church. But its day is not over yet.”

Your friend Simon Peter wondered about organized religion in our world today. He worries every day that the spirit of the living Christ is missing. He asks how to lift the spirit of the church.

“Peter, my dear friend, is such a responsible, weighty soul. This is of course a challenge. I used to preach occasionally in the synagogues of Galilee. But the errors there were glaring! It was infuriating! But what can man do? Man pulls together naturally in these gathering places. This structure can connect people. But each individual has to be responsible for his or her spirituality. So the church is made up of what you bring to it, not what you get from it. YOU BRING THE RISEN CHRIST. You must create your own relationship with God. Don’t go to church until you do this.”

“Are your churches today languishing? If so, now is the time to create your own strong relationship with God. YOU BE THE RISEN CHRIST. YOU BRING IT TO CHURCH. Put God back in the church, or enjoy God right where you are!”

“Talitha cum,” or damsel arise, was your saying. Does the church give a fair shake to women today?

“Women today are bursting onto the spiritual scene. This is a wonderful time for women. And this is a vital new religious infusion in the world. Men have abused their power in the church and women are now ready to step in. They will fill the gap in leadership. Women are all encouraging and all nurturing.”

Your friend Paul asked us to inquire about the “why” of your mission. It seemed to come out of nowhere and was over in a few short years. You were a wandering preacher. You had no established synagogue. You went from town to town. You had no Mishnah of formal public teaching. Why did you choose this path?

“Ah, Paul, always the sharp intellect, always analyzing. I came to serve the Jews. I went from Jewish center to Jewish center. Jews at this time were more advanced spiritually than other nations and had been faithful to God for so long. They asked to receive their prophet-and I was that prophet. I was sent in answer to their prayers. What I taught was the unconditional love and forgiveness of God. I didn’t bring them power or riches, but instead a purely spiritual message. I was speaking to the great soul of the Jewish religion. I was educated in prophecy and I was the answer to their prayers for a new prophet. I brought them a spiritual dominion.”

“Of course, my message was carried to the whole world. I was successful in converting the world to Judaism, in a sense. My brothers in Israel didn’t accept parts of my mission and so we parted ways. But all the world knows we are a close family. This is a Judea-Christian faith. And all the world knows the essence of the Jewish faith-its great devotion to the one God.”

Dear Rabbi, take us back to your younger days. You visited Jerusalem with your family and later met John the Baptist. You were his Talmid, were baptized by him, and learned repentance. We understand that you learned to meditate on God’s Throne and Chariot, the Son of Man, and the whole Kingdom of Heaven. Tell us what John taught you.

“He taught me courage! I was living at home and learned my journeyman’s craft from my father. But I knew I had a mission. I didn’t know how it should start. I needed courage, and John gave me that. He was so aflame with God’s spirit that he lit my light. As you know, he baptized me and he got me started. He introduced me to the multitudes who cam to him for baptism, his followers, and they became my followers later.”

You caused a great stir by instantly healing the worst diseases. What was the prayer or meditation you used to accomplish these healings? Could we learn how to do this, as your disciples did?

“Your question is confusing to your wife. She has been a healer all her life.”

But I can’t heal anyone of anything. Might we learn how to do this?

“Do you believe spiritual healing is possible?”

Yes, certainly. But I (John ) am not a success in doing this.

“Well, you must go back to your misconception about not being in heaven. You must recognize that all men live in the heart of perfect love. Strive for this consciousness, not an altered physical state. When you recognize the Allness of God and spiritual life, and when you bring another person into the same state of mind-for a single second-you heal them. When you ask God to bring you into this consciousness, ask God also to bring that consciousness to your fellow man. Then you can heal: nothing can stop you.”

When you raised people from the dead, like your friend Lazarus, did you use the same kind of healing prayer?

“Yes. Remember that God is all-powerful, and nothing can deny God’s expression. God’s love always triumphs! This is an eternal truth: meditation on the divine order brings a sense of power and an immediate reordering of circumstances.”

You also exorcised demons. But we are told there are no bad spirits. Were you curing a kind of mental illness?

“What I cured was the belief in bad powers. People accepted those beliefs and they grew inside them. Submission of this kind creates illness. It is dissipated by God’s influence.”

The Bible reports that you walked on water, rebuked the wind, and multiplied fish and loaves. How did you accomplish these miraculous things?

“Spirit is dominant over the material world. God trumps all limits. The elements, man’s supply, all such things are within the dominion of God. These miracles are powerful expressions of metaphysical truth. I came to show that God’s providence prevails all the time. And it was not just me who had these abilities: this is true for all men. Greater things will you do!”

You taught people in Palestine to expect the coming of God’s Kingdom. Some thought this would be the coming of a new Judas Maccabeus, or a new King David, with relief from Roman oppression. Others thought you were describing the end of time. What did the arrival of God’s Kingdom mean to you?

“What I was teaching was that God’s Kingdom already has come! It was not something that was going to come later. I taught that the prophecy was fulfilled right now! The prophecy was not me, but the new consciousness of the all-loving God. My brothers had become comfortable with the idea of a far-off Messiah. But as I just told you, we are all in heaven right now! God’s Kingdom is inside us! With this message I satisfied the prophecy. You are rulers of a new Kingdom now. And you will do greater things in the new Kingdom. But people heard what they had been taught for years and years and they expected the future coming of some new warrior king.”

Dear friend, you were called so many names, Son of Man, Son of God, the anointed Christ, and Messiah. How did you understand these terms? And how were you different from others?

“These terms apply to all men, all mankind. I talked to Jews but the message knows no bounds. All men are one with God.”

In later years, the church described you as a savior whose sacrifice on the cross atoned for sin and permitted believers in you to enter heaven. Your friend Paul began that teaching, which later became a sermon about sinners in the hands of an angry God. What is your view of this teaching?

“This is such a tragic misconception, the idea of blood sacrifice and atonement! Unfortunately, this is the mythology man is comfortable with. It is a complete inversion and misstatement of my mission. This isn’t my message at all. I am the risen Christ! I am triumphant. I triumphed as the Son of God; and every man is the Son of God. My Father will break through this miasma in church teaching.”

In your famous Sermon on the Mount you taught men to love one another, turn the other cheek, and to love God with all their heart, mind and soul. This was the most magnificent sermon ever preached. It combined ancient wisdom with new wisdom in unforgettable imagery. Where did your amazing preaching abilities come from?

“I got my preaching abilities from the same place Moses got his abilities! I stood directly in the line of God’s prophets. I accepted my mission and that acceptance brought forth these words.”

Our Bible does describe you as a man with a temper. You called the Pharisees hypocrites and vipers, and sometimes threatened them with damnation. But we are told there is no such thing as damnation. What were you really saying?

“I hated to see men like these in the temple. I hated to see them preen and congratulate themselves on their spiritual wisdom. I wanted to help them understand how misconceived their notions were. They were going in the wrong direction. It is true there is no damnation, but man can veer off the path, and this creates suffering for himself and others.”

“I longed to have my people embrace the truth that all men have the God Soul, and so must give up earthly enticements, privileges and powers. That was the reason for this stern talk. I intended to help them.”

When you went to the temple at Sukkoth and overturned the tables of the money changers, was that because they were dishonest, because they should not have been in the temple in the first place, or because the Book of Zechariah (14:21) predicted that in the Day of the Lord the money changers would be expelled?

This produced a long pause. We received the following answer, which reflected some simmering anger.

“There is no place in a temple for that activity. The temple is not a bank. It is not a place to make money. It is a place for communion with God. This was wrong, and it offended me. What is right is right! We were losing our heart and soul, and this had to be thrown away. This was not a spiritual activity-it was the wrong concept. MAN SHOULDN’T SACRIFICE. This is a corrupt conception, and Paul had his hand in maintaining it. It is a terrible mistake and it is the wrong concept.”

But dear friend, the whole temple was a giant barbecue for slaughtered animals, your family brought animals to the temple, and these money changers tried to facilitate that same sacrificial ritual.

“True spirituality involves no sacrifice at all. The whole process was mistaken.”

Tell us then about your Last Supper with the disciples. You broke bread and said this is my flesh, and you said this wine is my blood. The church today has made this a ritual, the Eucharist, and worshippers are often told they are eating your flesh and drinking your blood­ like members in the cult of Mithras or Osiris. Was that what you intended to say? Or was this your way of saying that wine and bread, shared by the faithful, were a proper substitute for the sacrifice of flesh and blood in the temple?

“This was the right substitute, not people eating my flesh and blood. But the communion service is a miracle. Men and women come together with God over a meal. This meal symbolizes the UNITY of all mankind and of man with God.”

What is the meaning of the crucifixion in your life story? For many churches it has been the dominant theme-Christ Crucified.

“Well, it was dramatic, an exquisite piece of drama. And it was a hard experience for me, and even harder for my followers. But the resulting message is the RISEN CHRIST, not the suffering Christ. With my rising there came a great wave of awakening among all my followers. The veil between earth and heaven ripped open; the veil in the temple was torn in half. Was there a sacrifice here and an ordeal? Yes. But the triumph is what I remember. My fellows were transformed into evangelists! They had no strong mission until then. This energized the mission and filled my followers with courage.”

We· were pleased to hear from Mary Magdalene and Paul that you survived the crucifixion and emigrated to Gaul. How did you manage to survive this ordeal?

“I was pierced in hands and feet and suspended from the cross. I was supposed to suffocate, which would happen slowly. I passed out but was then taken down and revived.”

Tell us about your life in Gaul. Did you go with Mary and have a daughter, as we have

“In Gaul I was safe with my family. But we had to be careful. And I understood that my days of travel were over. This new life was a life of meditation and prayer and my dear wife has taken  care of me in a sweet country. I was known only as a holy man. But I did support the ongoing mission of my followers through prayer. I gave thanks to our Father for their actions.”

Tell us about your daughter. And tell us how long your family lived in Gaul.

Jesus sent a picture of a little girl with red hair.

“Her name was Tamar. She was a beautiful child, and we took great care with her. She was our joy. But she didn’t live until old age. We all died at about the same time.”

Tamar! What personal meaning resonates in the name of this beautiful child, born far from Galilee. The name is a window into the souls of Jesus and Mary two thousand years ago. Tamar in Hebrew means Palm Tree-straight and upright (Jer. 10:5), a fruitful tree (Joel 1:12), with great leaves that are tokens of victory and peace (I Mace. 13:51). When Greeks or Romans thought of Palestine, this was the symbol of the place. Tamar also was the wife of Er, son of Judah, and a matriarch of the ancestral tribe of Jesus. Tamar was the name of the beautiful sister and daughter of Absalom. And Tamar was a village at the furthest verge of Palestine in the time of Jesus and Mary-the destiny of a refugee.

How old did you live to be?

“I was in my 60s.”

Dear Chasid, dear Prophet, when you look into our world what do you see?

“I see the same thing I saw in Palestine 2000 years ago. I see the hearts of men longing for God-longing to be told that God loves, forgives, and supports them. I see people worn down by a hopeless world. I feel a great longing to come to them and lift them higher.”

And what do you see when you look at Israel today and Jerusalem?

“I see a fervent flame that is leaping up. I see a great flame that is leaping up. This is a fervent place, a place of great death, and a place of great birth, at this time. Life flows through this place, this very great place, and it is always rising up!”

If your followers in the modern world were assembled again around the mountainside, what would you say to them in this day and age?

You know, I would give them what they need and want-a sense of peace. The world is embattled and embittered. Man is more advanced, but he feels encumbered. Every where he looks he is surrounded by material demands. He doesn’t know where to turn to find peace. I would give the Asian admonition that man needs to find peace in his relationship with God, and then bring that peace to the whole world! The world needs that now. Very few now have a quiet mountaintop to go to. Today man needs to create an altar in his heart and carry that with him!”

And what advice can you give to us? You can see that we are hoping to share these readings with others.

“Dear friends, fellow searchers, be patient. I never ,saw my teachings accepted on any broad scale. Paul was the first to go forth broadly, and it was 300 years before our church was accepted in Rome-and by then its message was corrupted. It takes time to wi ness change. I would stay faithful to the message and keep it pure. Keep the message on target and keep moving forward. Look at my life! I wasn’t sure I had made a difference. I didn’t know what the outcome was going to be. But this is how you live: your life is sent by God; you hear the word of God. You can’t ask for anything more. Think of me, and remember that all true messages from God reach out to the whole universe.”

Thank you dear Jesus, dear Yeshua, for speaking with us today and sharing your wisdom. No man has done as much as you to lift spiritual consciousness. We hope you will bless this generation of men, and open the door to heaven for all mankind.

Dear friends, you already are in heaven. The door is shut behind you, for all eternity.”

If you have any questions for John and Martha their email is

You can also email me and comment below with your thoughts

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